 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
| Vance | Maggi | Michael | Ying Lan | John |
| USA | Germany | Australia | Taiwan | Puerto Rico |
Vance's CALL
resources page| esl_home
index | links for ESL
students
Webheads: Main Page |
Welcome | Students |
Virtual Community | Online
Class | Chat Logs | Reports and Studies | Grammar!
Time conversions:
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/full.html
and more
Chat: voice:
http://www.chariot.net.au/~michaelc/hearme.htm
| text: http://www.homestead.com/vstevens/
Next visit, start at http://www.netword.com/webheads
Meet the people in the chat today
|
|
|
|
|
| Vance | Maggi | Michael | Ying Lan | John |
| USA | Germany | Australia | Taiwan | Puerto Rico |
and our friend Marina from Italy
Today's chat started in the Palace with John, Vance and Maggi fooling around with avatars. We had ourselves all lined up as 3 Maggis at one point, and then we all appeared as 3 Johns, but no students were there to see the fun. Finally Ying Lan arrived and then Marina (so we quickly got back into our real avatars). We had a very interesting discussion, talking in Hear Me, with some text chat in Hear Me and even less at the Palace - the Palace crashed on us again but came back.
Ying Lan had been reading Harry Potter but she had been reading it for quick comprehension and not attending to each word, so we discussed whether it was better to focus on accuracy or fluency. Marina thought it was better to read for pleasure and for fluency. This got us into the role of context in language, for example the words 'witch' and 'which', which Michael claimed were indistinguishable in Australian English. Vance disputed this and collected evidence to the contrary, presented below. The point was however, that these two words would never be confused in English because they would always be distinguishable by context.
Meanwhile, the discussion of Harry Potter had taken us into other books of fantasy and magic such as Tolkien's Ring Trilogy, and Marina had some interesting stories to tell, such as one about an actress friend of hers who was into the occult. Marina is about to go on a trip with her husband and child to Paris and London, but I hope she'll write us more about these topics when she gets back.
Here is the experiment that Vance did during the discussion. The question is: is there any difference in English between the words 'witch' and 'which'? Here is the evidence. You decide!
You can click on the links to open or download Vance saying: "Which witch is which?" and then you have to decide what I say, 'which' or 'witch'. Then Michael says, "What am I saying?" and again he says, 'witch' or 'which' ... well, you decide which.
Finally, study the wave forms and see if you can tell what the difference is.
|
Click here if you need to
download the Real Player. |
 |
Vance says: "Which witch is which?" The two wave forms to the right are 'which' and 'witch' ... But which is which??? But you can see a difference, can't you? (the wh- sound is fuller) You can try to download or open the
Real Media file here. |
| Michael says, "What am I saying?" And in these wave forms, he says 'which' or 'witch' (but which first?). The wave form in the middle is the word 'or'. Again, you can see a difference, can't you? (I think wh- is first; again. It appears fuller, with a buildup before the peak) You can try to download or open the Real Media file here. If that doesn't work, try to download it from Prohosting: http://lightning.prohosting.com/~vstevens/sounds/witchwhich.ra Right-click on this link and save the file on your computer, then play it with the Real Media Player. |
 |
I have visited that link and checked it out. It is surely an interesting learning experience and maybe, whenever I come across words which or witch, I may recall both of your pronunciation. Thank you, Bora, email to eclass 18 Sep 2000
Which chat would you like to see now: Hear Me | Palace
Status: Connected
Vance has joined
Maggi has joined
Ying has joined
Ying: hi, Vance
Ying: you are in the palace. aren't you?
Maggi: the Palace froze
Vance: We were there but I've shut it down
Maggi: I'm trying agin but so far no luck
Maggi: it says connected but there is no pic
Ying: Vance, did you post Bora's story on Webheads?
Ying: I don't understand your last words.
Vance: I got a message that she felt she had made a good friend with you.
Vance: Is that the story that you mean?
Ying: It is very pretty nice to hear such message from her.
Ying: No...
Ying: She told me she posted something on webheads.
Vance: netword.com/webheads?
Ying: No... I just visited webheads.. it works.
Vance: Maybe she posted to egroups, but egroups is down right now
Ying: but I can not find her articles on webheads.
Vance: they are doing site maintenance. They'll come back in about 5 or 6 hours
Ying: How come?
Vance: There's a notice up at their site
Maggi: be back in a min guys
Ying: If she posted messages.. I could read them from email.
Vance: Well, if you visit the site you'll see an explanation
Ying: E-group?
Ying: Sorsah is a preey girl...
Ying has joined
Ying: Yes.
Ying has left
Ying: Harry Potter
Marina has joined
Ying: Really?
Michael has joined
Vance: accuracy vs. fluency
Ying: Hi, michael... you just interruped Marina's word.
Michael: I only spent 2 hours watching the Olympics today!
Ying: only spent 2 hours.... you mean you should spend full day to watch it.
Michael: Soem people do watch all day Ying!
Michael: And I agree with Marina...
Vance: Are you trying to wean yourself Michael?
Michael: That's true Maggie.
Ying: But I think when I read the book with ignoring some words, maybe I just misunderstand the author.
Michael: Re weaning - it is wee bit addictive....
Vance: Maggi teases us
Vance: So we tease her ..
Michael: Who's in the Palace?
Maggi: John
Michael: Which book?
Vance: Harry Potter
Michael: OK
Maggi: we are alone at the Palace
Michael: Maybe Potter's book is allegorical? (from allegory)
Ying: I have been kicked off the palace.
Ying: It is a child book.
Ying: What?
Ying: maggi can you restate?
Vance: She said it's about wizardry and fantasy
Ying: What kind of book?
Ying: good of what?
Ying: idole
Vance: and she said it is a book for adults, good for adults
Ying: oh...yes.
Ying: adult
Vance: like a good fairy tale, so it's written on children and adult levels
Michael: That's right Ying.
Ying: On Amaon.com... it said ... a child book from 9 to 12.
Marina has left
Marina has joined
Ying: Have you read Harry Potter?maggi.
Michael: Did you enjoy the Harry Potter book Ying?
Vance: Do you know about Hobbits?
Ying: Yes, I did... I have strong emotion to buy book 2 when I finished the book 1.
Ying: i had...
Vance: a strong desire
Michael: Those books by Tolkien were truly amazing.
Michael: (Tolkien wrote the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings.)
Ying: Tolkien is a writer?
Michael: That's right Ying
John has joined
Ying: hello John.
Ying: I also had a strong deisre to buy the tapes of Harry Potter book 1.
John: Hi everybody. I don't have voice, today, just text.
Vance: Hello John, can you hear us?
Ying: But it sold out before I asked the book company here.
Ying: Hi, John.
John: To an extent (with a lot of background noise)
Vance: can you get it from amazon.com?
Maggi: sure
Ying: Yes, I can.. but it is more expensive than I but it from local book company.
Ying: what?
Vance: The opposite is true here
Ying: I concentrated on my sentence.
John: Same here.
Maggi: it is a fantasy world
Ying: magic world.
Michael: Gandalf!
Maggi: Gandolf is kewl
Ying: I wish I were a witch.
Ying: when I was a little girl.
Michael: witch/which - same pronunciation
Ying: Am I freak?
Vance: You wished you could be a witch?
Ying: why not?
Michael: lol
Vance: You would be a good witch
Ying: Thanks , Vance.
Michael: Know any witches John?
John: I know a few witches, Michael. In fact, like Ying, I wanted to be a warlock.
Ying: What is a warlock?
John: A warlock is a male witch.
Maggi: a male witch
John: Women are witches, Men are warlocks.
Michael: lol
Ying: Don't you say a wizard?
Maggi: a wizard is different
John: I didn't really know there was a difference.
Ying: what?
Ying: more powerful?
Ying: more netective?
Ying: negective?
Michael: negative/
Michael: Leprechauns
Ying: What is leprechauns?
Ying: A little person?
John: Sorry, an emergency just came up here. Gotta go.
Michael: Yes - little people - like imps or elves.
Ying: Say bye-bye to John.
John has left
Michael: Ok John - see ya!
Marina: BYE John
Ying: I think he is busy to talk to his colleague.
Ying: what?
John has joined
John: back again. Problem solved.
Ying: What is the music?
Ying: door belling?
Maggi: that was quick John
Michael: What music?
Marina: Welcome back, John
John: Yeah, my wife was having problems giving my grandaughter a treatment. She couldn't find part of the machine
Ying: it is behind your voice .... ten minutes ago.
Ying: it was
Vance: what was?
Michael: Behind my voice?
Ying: yes,....
Ying: Maybe I was wrong.
Maggi: the sound he gets when an email comes in
Maggi: part of his email program
Michael: Yes - that's the sound I get when I get new email.
Ying: I also got email from Bora.
John: Third person I ever heard of that uses AOL
Michael: Me too Ying.
Michael: lol!
Ying: Aol is in trouble?
Maggi: No...but I think it is garbage
Maggi: INHO
Maggi: IMHO
Ying: John... you don't use AOL>
Ying: What is IMHO?
John: No, I use a local service called Carribean Networking.
Ying: Sorry... I do not undersatnd what you said about AOL.
Vance: In my humble opinion ...
Maggi: IN MY HUMBLE OPINION
John: My sister-in-law and one of my students use it.
Ying: maggi, what's your humble opinion?
Maggi: My son had it at first and it was full of unwanted stuff
Maggi: that AOL is garbage
Ying: I think AOL is a great ISP company.
Maggi: everyone to his own opinion
Ying: I don't know it is right or not. Because I am not a user of AOL.
Maggi: they are getting so big they are getting like Microsoft
Maggi: I like competition
John: So do I.
Ying: AOL is going to combine with another media.
Maggi: and Linux is giving Microsoft a run for it's money now
Ying: You still discuss with which and witch...
Maggi: not unless they get the ok
Ying: I speak so fast... so you don't udnerstand what I said.
Ying: psychology?
Ying: what is the language psychology?
Marina: I'm just listening to the conversation.You are changing the subject quickly today!
Ying: It is getting more serious.
Michael has left
Vance: from the context
Vance: you can tell what you can't understand from context
Ying: You can figure out what the person is from his words.
Michael has joined
Michael: Back again!
Maggi: :-)
John: Welcome back, Michael.
Ying: marina... sometims I did not understand what they said, either.
Maggi: it's good for your passive understanding
Vance: I'll try to write some.
Ying: I pretend to know what they said. And asked ...
Maggi: LOL
Ying: Sometims,,, nobody answered my question.
Michael: (smiles)
Ying: Because they concentrated on their words.
Ying: What is your thinking?
John has left
Ying: Four yeas ago.....
Vance: Which question, YL?
Ying: Never mind.
Ying: Who is very strange?
Vance: Marina's friend from an acting course
Ying: A real witch?
Vance: But don't forget, she's also an actress ...
Maggi: iris
Vance: The strangest person you have ever met?
John has joined
Ying: Waaa... she met a real witch.
Maggi: go to NYC and you will see lots of strange people :-)
John has left
Michael: lol
Michael: She may be a member of some occult group?
Ying: Have you seen any magic... or she ride a broomstick?
Michael: Vance is sceptical!
Ying: occult group?
Ying: I think the occult group only happened in China.
Michael: Occult - people who work with black magic, the devil, the afterlife....
Ying: But it sounds they are exist in everywhere.
Vance: What did I say, it's strange because it is or because these people made it SEEM strange ...
John has joined
John: Back again
Marina: I think she just participated to strange ceremonies and she believed in them
Michael: Having connection problems John?
Ying: marina.. Do you meet the person who you suspected she is a witch.
John: Yep. My server has been giving problems for the past couple of weeks.
Ying: Do you meet her again?
Marina: She believed to be a witch
Ying: What kind or problems?
Ying: You beleive she is a witch or she just believed to be a withc.. she is not a witch.
John: It just keeps freezing up, disconnecting, and other things like that. Problem is, it is the local server. If I connect through long distance, I have no problems.
Ying: John.. it is o.k. for us. but you have to spent more time to connect it.
Ying: spend
John: I also lose part of the conversation, Ying.
Ying: ohyy.. yea. it is a problem.
Michael: Do people have the power to influence events in other people's lives? (like magic)
Ying: I don't know...
John: Michael, my boss influences events in my life (like by calling me to meetings on my day off).
Michael: I thnk they do. Australian Aborigines certainly believe so.
Vance: talking about hodgekins disease as an explanation for the strange behavior of witches in Salem in the 17th century in the USA
Maggi: is he a warlock John?
Ying: Some people have the power to influence ...
Michael: (not that kind of influence Vance!) I guess I mean 'unseen' influence.
John: Maggi, he says no, but I think he might be.
Michael: Like - can they make you sick by willing it upon you?
Maggi: if you believe it yes...
John: I think Michael has hit on it. If you believe it is going to work on you, yes, you can get sick.
Michael: I think you're right Vance.
Ying: Michael.. I belive that... someone has a magic power to infulence someone's behviour.
Vance: and there are psychosomatic illnesses ...
Maggi: the mind is a powerful thing
Vance: and some people can cure themselves through positive thinking ..
Ying: Have you watched a movie titled "the sixth sence"?
Michael: No....
Maggi: I'm trying
Michael: Not magic!
Vance: psychology, not magic, ok
Ying has joined
John: Afraid I'm going to have to sign out now. See you next week. (If not before)
Michael: Me too John, I'm getting scared by all this stuff!
Ying: somepeople can cure themself by positive thinking is a psychology.. not a magic.
John has left
Maggi: ok...nice tio have you here
Ying has left
Maggi: it's positive thinking Ying
Maggi: and you can use this energy to help yourself
Ying: i benhind my schedule .... I could not concentrated on my job last week.
Maggi: like Reike
Ying: marina... you are looking for what?
Michael: Sorry to leave in the middle of your story Marina - I have a lot of work to do before I go to bed. Goodnight everyone.
Maggi: slaap lekker
Vance: She was working for an accountant
Vance: nite michael
Ying: good night michael.
Michael: Dank je wel.
Michael has left
Maggi: soede droemme
Ying: I have to go now.
Ying: Thanks marina .. your story.
Maggi: sounds nice Marina
Ying: Travelling?
Maggi: sleep well Ying
Ying: Only for 2 days... it is too short to stay in England.
Which chat would you like to see now: Palace | Hear Me
The Palace - Avatar-based text chat logs (Vance has added comments in italics)
No connection - Click Anywhere to enter a Palace
Searching for Plug-ins...
PalacePresents Viewer Installed!
Connecting to Welcome.thepalace.com:9998
Connecting to efi.virtualscholar.com:9998
Connected via TCP
*** Welcome to The Virtual School House Vance!
Vance: @64,64 !It's Vance
John: I'm going to have to have my sound card and modem reconfigured this week.
John: Hi, vance.
MichaelC: @64,64 !It's MichaelC
John: Go to see you again, Michael
MichaelC: Success!
MichaelC: Hi there John.
marina: @64,64 !It's marina
John: Hello, Marina.
Mad: Hi Marina
marina: HI!
Vance: So, where shall we talk today ...
Mad: everywhere?
Vance: why not .. where are you today, Marina?
marina: At home
Vance: Ah, in the Palace .. and following us in Hear Me as well?
Vance: Do you know about Hobbits?
Mad: can you hear us John
John: I can hear you with a lot of back ground noise.
John: Sorry an emergency just came up here. gotta go.
Mad: bye John...nice to see you
Vance: bye
Mad: Michael...get kicked from hearme
MichaelC: I just got disconnected from the voice chat....
Mad: tsk tsk
Vance: I think it happens to doubters, Michael ...
Which chat would you like to see now: Palace | Hear Me
Use the navigation at the top of this page or your browser's BACK button to return to a previous page
For comments, suggestions, or further information on this page, contact Vance Stevens, page webmaster.